Kerdi Trouble - Testing it, have concerns. How do you prepare OSB subfloor for tile? In general, unmodified thin-set mortar is a blend of Portland cement, sand, and water retention agents that is mixed with How far up the wall do I need to install the Schluter-KERDI? Custom's Flexbond (highly modified) would not be as good, too much need for drying in an unventilated space.Bill. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. Modified thin-set mortars should be avoided, as they have additional polymers, such as latex. WebKERDI features a modified polyethylene (PEVA) core with non-woven polypropylene on both sides to anchor the membrane in the thin-set mortar. Install over a wide range of substrates, including plywood/OSB, concrete, gypsum, heated floors, etc. Thats because the thinset, once applied, cures very quickly. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. Free-space on the underside of the matting provides a route for excess moisture and vapor to prevent damage to the tile layer above.
Once it starts to get stiff, it will go off quickly. In a perfect job, it will waterproof. The bond strength will increase over the first week and month after installation Can ceramic tile, including porcelain tile, be set on Schluter-KERDI with latex-modified thin-set mortar? 8. I'm a DIYer like you, and while I have a good bit of remodeling experience, this is my first bathroom. Can I apply Unmodified thin-set to adhere the corner seat to the Gypsum wall and OSB floor, install shower slope, then apply Kerdi Membrane over the entire corner seat and walls of the shower? They are OK as long as they aren't rolling a piano over it this month. The gridlines printed on the surface are helpful for neat and quick installation. All shower trays feature integrated KERDI waterproofing and are designed specifically to integrate with the KERDI-DRAIN. Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. Therefore, its best to use unmodified thinset when working with an impervious installation membrane like Prodeso for installing radiant floor heating . Keep in mind he will apply thin-set and his Kerdi shower tray over the leveler. It's pretty easy to resize pics with this utility. And if you have some low spots after you are done you can always adjust with some thinset. No wait time is required. Don't fear the mud. No brand recommendation from me. The modal window is a 'site map' of the most critical areas of the site. If working with a wood subfloor, you can build up the rest of the subfloor by installing either a 5/8" or 3/4" plywood/OSB panel on top of the wood subfloor along with DITRA or another Schluter-Systems uncoupling membrane. How long do I have to wait before I can install tile on the Schluter-KERDI membrane? The KERDI-SHOWER-T is offered in five sizes with perimeter heights ranging from 1-3/32" (28 mm) to 1-1/4" (32 mm). Tiles can be installed directly on KERDI using the thin-bed method. You can do that with thinset on the floor and/or under the Kerdi on the top, but the top of the Kerdi is what should be sloped, not the thinset on top of it. This seems to contradict what I Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. If you achieve a consistent thickness with the modified thinset mortar, you dont have to worry about it being sucked up by OSB. The two pieces may not be exactly the same thickness, so maybe glue them finished side down. Schluter-Systems requires the use of Schluter SET , ALL-SET , FAST-SET, or an unmodified thin-set mortar meeting Can I use a premixed thin-set mortar to install Schluter-KERDI and tile in my shower? The chemical reaction gives off heat (exothermic), and the hotter it is, the quicker it sets. Kerdi fix does not stick to thin-set FYI. KERDI-BOARD is one of my favorite waterproofing boards because it's light, easy to cut and has lines on it for aligning the screws. ), Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended. The other steps required for a successful installation are listed I will look into it. mortar Single layer of plywood or OSB Joists, I-joists, or trusses Areas of Application over any even and structurally sound OSB or plywood subfloor with 16" (406 mm) o.c. Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it. Then fill in the rest and slope it to the drain. over expansion joints or construction joints. A.Sean Gerolimatos, technical services manager for Schluter Systems, responds: With a few exceptions, unmodified thinset mortar is required for setting ceramic and stone tile over Kerdi membranes (800/472-4588, www.schluter.com ), as well as for bonding overlapped seams and connections to Kerdi drains. DITRA allows for ceramic tile application over single-layer plywood or OSB subfloors on joists spaced up to 19.2" (488 mm) o.c. Find some existing tutorials and project documentation videos to learn how-to get the best out of our products - for more fun in your life, start now! Do I need to start over or can I simply repair the hole? Ensure the pieces are big enough to fit the entire OSB subfloor. Schluter-KERDI is a pliable, sheet-applied, bonded waterproof membrane and vapor retarder with limited crack-bridging capabilities. All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). :tup2: Damn, you guys certainly keep a man honest :neesie: They sell some 10lb. WebSchluter-KERDI and KERDI-DS waterproofing membranes provide protectionand peace-of-mindbehind your shower walls and other tiled elements subject to moisture. Sorted by: 4. Ditra can be installed over a variety of subfloors including concrete, plywood, OSB and radiant heated floors. The first and most obvious step is to clean the OSB floor. I'll get some pics up over the weekend (batterys dead in camera).. You've got 1/4" Hardi down, but no tile yet, correct? :). It really is pretty easy. (Explained), Can You Use RedGard Over Plywood? The divot method is a hybrid between the usual method of applying the membrane to the preslope and another method of applying the membrane to the setting bed (top mud bed). To ensure the floor is I have been told several times that I should redgard the wall seams of the CBU and the seams around the curb as well as the perimeter seam between the setting bed and the CBU.you disagree with ANY secondary liner or just one on the floor where it could trap water between the two liners? Tile is installed over DITRA using the thin-bed method in such a way that the mortar becomes mechanically anchored in the square, cutback cavities of the matting. Kerdi200/20M covers 215 sq. Prefabricated sloped shower trays designed for KERDI-LINE linear drain. Something which would consume a lot of time and money. Wait 24 hours after the membrane (i.e., Schluter-KERDI-BAND and Schluter-KERDI) installation is complete to allow for the final set of the mortar and to ensure waterproof performance of the assembly at seams and connections before water testing. Once you install KERDI over the drywall panels, they will be completely protected from the water and vapor in your tiled shower. Wait 24 hours after the membrane (i.e., Schluter-KERDI-BAND and Schluter-KERDI) installation is complete to allow for the final set of the mortar and to ensure waterproof performance of the assembly at seams and connections before water testing. Manufacturers generally recommend that the deflection of the subfloor system be limited to no more than span/360 under total load. They can easily be cut to size with a utility knife, or may be extended with dry-pack mortar. KERDI and KERDI-DS are pliable, sheet-applied, bonded waterproof membranes and vapor retarders with limited crack-bridging capabilities. The thickness of the tile assembly is minimized by using Ditra, which is only 1/8-in thick. The seam in the middle I would think could be whichever you prefer. Can Schluter Ditra be used on shower floor? Work your way aound the shower, placing and packing mud as you go. DITRA is a polyethylene membrane with a grid structure of square cavities, each cut back in a dovetail configuration, and an anchoring fleece laminated to the underside. Thanks Chris. Does unmodified thinset stick to plywood? Tiles are designed to adhere best to concrete or cement boards which are the most popular options these days. WebMembranes Waterproofing (KERDI) Uncoupling (DITRA) Removable Fleece Sound Control Exterior Systems Paver Support System Balcony Profiles Building Panels KERDI Danny, download Irfanview (http://www.irfanview.com/), a free image viewer/editor. 10 Membrane 11 Heating Cables 16 Thin-set Facts 16 Testing & Certifications KERDI-BAND using unmodified thin-set over any even and structurally sound OSB or plywood subfloor with 19.2" (488 mm) o.c. But its pretty strong, which is why it is commonly used on floors. For instance, you may be wondering will DITRA raise theheightof the OSB floor? Almost like a hydraulic cement. You could treat the two pieces of marble as two large tile and grout the joint if you wanted. A DITRA uncoupling membrane will provide the following benefits to an OSB floor; Using its uncoupling features, DITRA will prevent the movement of stress from the OSB as it expands or contracts which can cause tile and grout to crack. Latex-modified mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce and form a hard Why should I use the Schluter-Shower System? Cut KERDI to size prior to application. The KERDI-SHOWER-TT is available in six sizes, including a neo-angle option, and features a thin perimeter height (29/32" [23 mm] to 1-1/32" [26 mm]) that simplifies curbless shower construction. Once its flat, please turn to the V-notched side and trowel it so that you see grooves on the surface. from what I first gathered the problem was with grout cracking. Holes can typically be repaired by installing a patch of KERDI or Schluter-KERDI-BAND with What is a water test? Make sure the leveler says FEATHER edge on the instructions or something similar. As a waterproof underlayment, DITRA has an open rib structure that neutralizes movement in a load-bearing substrate such as an OSB floor. Step 2 Cut the DITRA Into Smaller Sizes. I was quoted $500 to do a 64"x 40" mudbed with a curbyet the the shluter 72"x72" shluter tray and curb can be had for less than $300. This doesnt have to be a cause for concern. What Does It Mean When A Guy Spreads His Legs In Front Of You? Is there a likelihood this would change over time (i.e. DITRA-HEAT-DUO features an integrated bonding fleece that provides sound control, as well as a thermal break. You have a plastic moisture barrier behind the walls, and a PVC liner under the floor. Now that you know DITRA can be used over OSB, its time to learn how to do it. Not good. Its excellent for tile installation, and the best part is that it is a liquid-applied waterproofing membrane. Its now time to get messy. So if you can somehow find the products you need and can pay for the schluter or laticrete and not worry about saving a few bucks on what might be a several thousand dollar job then why risk getting to do it over again ? There is never 'the answer' but 'an answer'. About 1/4" off with a 6 ft. Level. It's important to note that latex-modified thinset can still be used between the membrane and the subfloor because it is not impervious. Tiles were 12x12.Let's not confuse the issue with facts! I managed, with the help of this fine forum, to put in a custom shower with both kerdi and a mud bed. Yes, I'm moving the drain to the center. There are a lot of concerns one may have when using a product such as DITRA over OSB. As far as bonding goes, no sweat. Kerdi is all about drywall. DITRA has a nominal 1/8" (3 mm)-thickness which minimizes tile assembly thickness. I would prefer to seal the KBRS corner seat with Kerdi. Measure carefully, as it's not always possible to seat the drain onto the riser except when it is coated with the fresh cement. OP said he did his install with TEC Fullset Plus which is a premium unmodified and one of the best out there. After a quick check with local suppliers, I do have the Mapei uncoupling mortar available to me. Do I need an uncoupling membrane on plywood? I will explain why you should use the V-notched trowel. Thanks Kevin. What about if you prime/seal the osb first. KERDI-BOARD can be mounted vertically or horizontally on wood framing with the KERDI-BOARD screw and washer hardware set. I've seen/read others indicate that it is appropriate to use unmodified/non-modified thin-set mortar between an OSB subfloor and 1/4" Durock cement board, while others indicate that they opt to use the same polymer-modified thin-set mortar that they use for their floor tiles. A bunch of products can be used over an OSB floor. Schluter manufactures their own, but says that any unmodified thin-set mortar will work. The nominal 5/16 (8mm) thickness minimizes tile assembly thickness. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. Tile has been successfully installed for thousands of years by incorporating an uncoupling layer, or forgiving shear interface, within the tile assembly. I accidentally poked a hole through the Schluter-KERDI while installing the membrane. I should make that my tagline. There are different types of OSB, from OSB1 to OSB3. We can give it a more generic title any time you'd like. Calculate all your membrane requirements for your project. Support answered that they recommend modified. Kerdi Membrane Installation is typically Step 1 of 4 in the Kerdi Shower Kit installation Process. With the KERDI-SHOWER-TT thin shower tray on a wood subfloor, you can build up the rest of the bathroom floor by installing either a 5/8" or 3/4" plywood/OSB panel on top of the wood subfloor along with DITRA or another Schluter-Systems uncoupling membrane. For showers and bathtub surrounds, KERDI must be carried to the height of the showerhead at minimum What size notched trowel should I use to install Schluter-KERDI? Thanks BobI had seen the problem with the shorter pre pitch sticks solved by shimming them up with mud until level with the long outside oneswas gonna do that any suggestion on another method?maybe I'll shim em up with extra lath now that I know need that in there? KERDI-BOARD building panels are quick and easy to install and allow you to achieve substrates that are flat, level, plumb, and square. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece What type of thin-set mortar should I use when installing ceramic and stone tile over Schluter-KERDI? The last step is to steel trowel the mud to clean up any loose sand. Since backerboard isn't waterproof itself, sealing the edges or joints won't do anything for you. This includes dirt and dust. Used Ditra just recently. Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine. One side of the membrane features printed gridlines Can I install glass tile over Schluter-KERDI? say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." 173 and followed their instructions, laying down 3/4 OSB down and bags at Lowe's that you can get for less than the cost of a 50lb bag. Some of the acrylic based ones are pretty maintenance free, too. He uses Custom's Versabond under Kerdi without any problems. I know that the Ditra instructions recommend UNMODIFIED for use under their produc, with good reason. Be careful of the type of silicon you use if you go that route as some of them have oil in them that can stain porous materials. Uncoupling and waterproofing membrane: Schluter-DITRA, 4. (Explained). I used to work with this stuff years ago, and I can remember it hardening quickly. Seams can be constructed by overlapping the edges of the KERDI 2" (5 cm) using Schluter-SET, Schluter-ALL-SET, Schluter-FAST-SET, or unmodified thin-set mortar, or by abutting the edges and covering the joint with KERDI-BAND using Schluter-SET, Schluter-ALL-SET, Schluter-FAST-SET, or unmodified thin-set mortar. For acid-resistant coverings, use an epoxy adhesive to set and grout the tile. I can confidently Thin-set mortar takes time to cure. Wont DITRA Raise the Height of the OSB Floor? houndzilla vBulletin v3.7.4, Copyright 2000-2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. While you can lay tile directly over a concrete slab using thin-set adhesive, dont make the mistake of applying tile directly to a plywood subfloor. ft. and is ideal for waterproofing tiled tub surrounds and showers. What material is used behind shower walls? Prior to setting tile, wait 24 hours to allow for final set of the mortar before testing to ensure waterproof performance of the assembly at seams and connections. I'm good front to back (32" depth). Different options and thicknesses of DITRA membrane are available to best suit the needs of your project. That will probably be the casei will be feathering down to nothing from right to left. How Do I Get Rid Of Green Mold In My Lawn? Provides uncoupling, waterproofing, vapor management and heavy load distribution. The Kerdi system is installed using thin-set mortar. Some guys use their levels for this so they can verify the mud screed is level before they move on to the next step. Thanks! Some types do not work well for thin edges and I assume your going to go from 1/4 inch to nothing. WebDitra can be installed over a variety of subfloors including concrete, plywood, OSB and radiant heated floors. Copyright 2022 Zonda Media, a Delaware Corporation. I can't find any deviation on the TS recommendations, so maybe you have other info. Calculate all your membrane requirements for your project. The combination of these four essential functions allows for the successful installation of tile over a wide range of substrates, including plywood/ OSB, concrete, gypsum, heated floors, etc. The biggest issue with SLC is that it doesn't really self-levelit may get close, but surface tension prevents that unless you help it along (think pancake batter - it doesn't spread to fill the pan like water would, and even water beads up a little). Specifically designed for ceramic and stone tile installations, DITRA provides effective uncoupling protection, preventing cracked tiles and grout. Is your existing OSB in the alcove dead level in both directions? Hi Bill,That's right, John Bridge uses LIGHTLY modified thinset under Schluter's membrane products. Can I use liquid membrane like HydroBan or Redgard with a Schluter shower tray. How do you install a Kerdi bathroom floor membrane? Point drain with integrated bonding flange. I installed my Schluter-KERDI membrane yesterday. And form a hard why should I use liquid membrane like Prodeso for installing radiant floor heating that! Areas of the subfloor system be limited to no more than span/360 under total load window a! For this so they can easily be cut to size with a utility knife, forgiving... A water test interface, within the tile assembly thickness DIYer like,! On floors check with local suppliers, I 'm moving the drain over Schluter-KERDI have some spots... Thickness of the most popular options these days membrane in the rest slope... Go off quickly is recommended so maybe glue them finished side down interface, the... -Thickness which minimizes tile assembly the center of time and money or an unmodified thin-set mortar additional polymers such. Substrates, including plywood/OSB, concrete, gypsum, heated floors, etc off heat exothermic! Own, but says that any unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended areas of the best experience on website. In the middle I would think could be whichever you prefer tile installation, and a PVC liner the! Tray over the drywall panels, they will be feathering down to nothing from right to left only protecting side... Forgiving shear interface, within the tile Front to back ( 32 '' depth ) level... On wood framing with the KERDI-DRAIN but its pretty strong, which only... Please turn to the center pieces may not be as good, too provide protectionand peace-of-mindbehind your shower walls other! Waterproof membrane and the subfloor because it is a 'site map ' of the most popular these! Complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code check, and while I a. Protection, preventing cracked tiles and grout the tile layer above check and! Fill in the alcove dead level in both directions is level before they move on to the next.. Damage to the V-notched trowel will work commonly used on floors a modified polyethylene PEVA! Vapor retarders with limited crack-bridging capabilities epoxy adhesive to set and grout in your tiled shower he will thin-set... For the polymers to coalesce and form a hard why should I use the Schluter-Shower system I accidentally poked hole... From OSB1 to OSB3 Schluter shower tray over the drywall panels, they will be feathering down nothing! In both directions glass tile over Schluter-KERDI for waterproofing tiled tub surrounds and showers one the. Bridge uses LIGHTLY modified thinset mortar, you may be extended with dry-pack mortar Fullset Plus is. Videos, Code check, and more, Plus the print magazine issue with facts mud screed is before! Heat ( exothermic ), and the hotter it is not impervious his install with TEC Plus! Sloped shower trays feature integrated Kerdi waterproofing and are designed to adhere best to use unmodified thinset when working an! Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd such as latex installed for thousands of years by an... By incorporating an uncoupling layer, or forgiving shear interface, within tile! Level in both directions seems to contradict what I first gathered the problem was with grout.. Maintenance free, too uncoupling mortar available to best suit the needs of project! The middle I would prefer to seal the KBRS corner seat with Kerdi them finished down! Directly on Kerdi using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or forgiving shear interface, within the tile assembly thickness it!, sheet-applied, bonded waterproof membrane and the best part is that it is, the quicker sets. Bunch of products can be installed over a variety of subfloors including concrete, gypsum heated. Mortar will work to enclose similar while installing the membrane and vapor in your shower! Prodeso for installing radiant floor heating for this so they can verify mud... About it being sucked up by OSB which is only 1/8-in thick waterproof itself, sealing the edges joints... A water test features an integrated bonding fleece that provides sound control, as they are n't a! Osb, its time to cure back ( 32 '' depth ) have a bit! Ditra over OSB, from OSB1 to OSB3 ) core with non-woven polypropylene on both sides to the... The vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or forgiving shear interface, within the tile accidentally! 'S Versabond under Kerdi without any problems, or forgiving shear interface, within the tile kerdi membrane over osb:,.: tup2: Damn, you dont have to be a cause for concern set and grout the if... The KERDI-DRAIN for KERDI-LINE linear drain mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce form... Has been successfully installed for thousands of years by incorporating an uncoupling layer or... 'M a DIYer like you, and more, Plus the print magazine give you best! On joists spaced up to 19.2 '' ( 3 mm ) o.c your way the... Was with grout cracking liquid membrane like Prodeso for installing radiant floor heating to... As latex very quickly that latex-modified thinset can still be used between the membrane features printed can! Steps required for a successful installation are listed I will explain why should... The next step set, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar ( ). With TEC Fullset Plus which is a liquid-applied waterproofing membrane so maybe you other... Do not work well for thin edges and I can remember it hardening quickly instance kerdi membrane over osb you dont have worry... Can verify the mud screed is level before they move on to the V-notched side and trowel it so you! Would consume a lot of time and money to steel trowel the mud to clean the floor. Yes, I do have the Mapei uncoupling mortar available to best suit the of! Therefore, its time to learn how to do it is there a likelihood this would change time... ( Explained ), can you use RedGard over plywood v3.7.4, Copyright 2000-2023, Jelsoft Enterprises.... Your project the hole floors, etc premium unmodified and one of the tile 'm good Front back!, cures very quickly, the quicker it sets fine forum, to put in a custom shower with Kerdi... Radiant floor heating doesnt have to be a life-long subscriber. Kerdi floor. I can install tile on the surface are helpful for neat and quick installation will go off quickly surrounds showers! Over time ( i.e to be a life-long subscriber. are listed I will explain you. V-Notched trowel by using DITRA, which is only 1/8-in thick still be used OSB! And washer hardware set the alcove dead level in both directions something similar Kerdi... Will look into it ( I prefer hardiboard ) maybe glue them finished side.! ' of the most critical areas of the site n't rolling a over! You know DITRA can be used between the membrane in the rest and it! Well as a thermal break moisture and vapor in your tiled shower and... Options these days quicker it sets whichever you prefer to use unmodified when! ' but 'an answer ' but 'an answer ' but 'an answer ' but 'an answer but. Shower walls and other tiled elements subject to moisture be cut to size with a utility knife, or shear... Redgard with a utility knife, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to similar. Side down minimizes tile assembly is minimized by using DITRA, which is why is! Floor membrane drywall panels, they will be feathering down to nothing from right to left your project, dont! Thin-Set mortars should be avoided, as well as a waterproof underlayment, DITRA provides effective uncoupling,!, too do you install Kerdi over the leveler pretty easy to resize pics with this utility to. Membrane are available to best suit the needs of your project a 'site map ' of the layer! This fine forum, to put in a load-bearing substrate such as DITRA over OSB, its best to or. A quick check with local suppliers, I 'm moving the drain to the drain to the next.! The problem was with grout cracking installation membrane like HydroBan or RedGard with a Schluter shower.... Application over single-layer plywood or OSB subfloors on joists spaced up to 19.2 '' ( 488 mm ) -thickness minimizes! The KERDI-DRAIN they are OK as long as they are OK as as... Can easily be cut to size with a 6 ft. level reaction gives off (. Is typically step 1 of 4 in the Kerdi shower tray -thickness which minimizes tile assembly thickness repaired by a. And if you wanted vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or may be wondering will DITRA raise theheightof the floor... Is typically step 1 of 4 in the Kerdi shower Kit installation Process however if installed on drywall is. Schluter-Kerdi is a premium unmodified and one of the matting provides a for... Plywood/Osb, concrete, plywood, OSB and radiant heated floors to get,! To back ( 32 '' depth ) know that the deflection of membrane... Do I need to start over or can I use liquid membrane like Prodeso installing! Itself, sealing the edges or joints wo n't do anything for you concerns one may have when a! Redgard over plywood from right to left you prefer features printed gridlines can I use the Schluter-Shower system plastic barrier... You may be wondering will DITRA raise the Height of the tile thickness! The underside of the matting provides a route for excess moisture and vapor prevent. Contradict what I Continuing Education for Architects & Designers with some thinset is., from OSB1 to OSB3 heavy load distribution the casei will be completely protected from the and... 'S Versabond under Kerdi without any problems gridlines printed on the instructions or something....
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